[00:00:00.000] - Speaker 1

Welcome to the Grit Reapers, the podcast for aspiring online entrepreneurs that cuts through all the crap in the online business world and dishes out the raw and real truth about what it really takes to have a successful online business. No sugar coating, no get-rich-quick schemes, just honest advice with a healthy dose of humor and hope.

[00:00:23.920] - Speaker 2

We're your hosts, Gail and Candice, two online entrepreneurs who've been there done that and live to tell the tale. So if you're looking for straight talk, practical tips, and the occasional reality check, to get your online business moving, you're in the right place. Let's get down to business.

[00:00:46.260] - Speaker 1

Welcome back, everybody. Well, I am so excited, and I have a little bit of FOMO sitting here in my little South African cold weathered desk. And Gail and Meg are together in Australia. Hello, everybody. I'm so excited to have Meg on. We thought this is the perfect opportunity, seeing as though Gail was going to be there with her. Meg, welcome. We're so happy to have you here.

[00:01:14.830] - Speaker 3

Thank you for having me. I'm excited to talk to you, ladies, especially on your podcast topic. I love it.

[00:01:21.360] - Speaker 1

Okay, yay. Well, the Grit Reapers is all about just saying things as it is, helping people really just come to terms with the truth and the reality of what it takes to have a successful online business. We speak about all kinds of things, from business to also just the personal side of grit and talking to people that have been through experiences in their life that are challenging and hard and what's the special source? What's the stuff that got them through it? We know you are absolutely no stranger to the online space. You are very, very successful I'm an online business owner and a mom and doing all the things. I often look at Meg and think, I don't know how she does this all. I'm like, being managing to wash my hair every few days.

[00:02:11.390] - Speaker 2

She makes it look so easy as well. It's amazing to see in real life how Meg is just calm and chilled.

[00:02:22.480] - Speaker 1

Totally. We thought, who better than someone who's got loads of experience and who has managed to create success for herself to come on and share with our listeners. I suppose the thing that I'd love us to talk about is like busting the BS, like the myths and the non instance that insiders know, like no, that's not how it works. If we had to say to you, what are some of the things you wish people knew? That is not quite how it works. What are your top myths that you want to just like, slash through and just help people just come to terms with, actually, that's not really how it works, and that it's better to know how it does work so that you don't feel overwhelmed and like, I'm going to jump off a bridge because this isn't happening for me. So take it away, Meg. Give us the gold.

[00:03:25.680] - Speaker 3

All right. Well, let's see how I go. But I think you are on the money with that. I see so much nowadays, especially since COVID. Now there is so much more happening in the online market space and loads of people online and in communities flashing all their numbers around, their launch numbers and their metrics and people who have, they look like an overnight success, but you just don't see that full story of what's been happening behind the scenes. How long have they actually been at it, creating their offers How many people did they start with on their email list? How much money did they put into ads to get those results that they're now just like, flashing around everywhere? You just get a glimpse of the story. That's the stuff I think, especially for the new creators, has this feeling like meh. It makes you feel really bad about yourself, especially if you fall into that trap of comparison and you feel like a fail. And how How are all these other new people having such amazing launches where I am struggling to grow my list by even five people a week? I think the first myth to dispel is anything that's focused around an overnight success because so much work goes into it.

[00:04:46.570] - Speaker 3

These results that you see out there never came overnight. Just so much work, time, energy, and money to get that stuff. People just don't share the full story, which I think is a shame. It's no I wonder people give up and feel miserable and burn out and all the things. I think that, for me, is the first myth of overnight success. I don't see that happening. Yeah, for sure.

[00:05:11.890] - Speaker 1

Because Gail is nodding along. I know all three of us have had this conversation, either together or in pairs. But Gail, you and I often talk about posts that we've seen in groups where this sentiment It's giving the impression that people are doing their first launch ever or brand new. Gaili, have you seen... How does this actually show up in real life, practically? What does this look like What are some of the things people say that we're thinking, No, that can't be the full story? What are the posts? What is the languaging that what Meg's talking about would appear?

[00:05:59.520] - Speaker 2

You know At the end of the day, I think what I've noticed is that in a lot of the groups, people are saying, I'm going through a beta launch, or it might be called a founder's launch, or a monetize before you make it launch. What other people are thinking, the context that you're sitting in when you brand new is that, Oh, this must be this person's first launch. But actually, what it so often turns out to be is that this is a launch of a new offer. So these people have already built their audiences, have already had other successes, and they're putting out, yes, to them it is a beta launch or it is a monetize before you make it, but on a new offer. So you'll see people who've just had a beta launch for $69,000. And then all the comments below are people like, Oh, how did you do it? How did you do it? Because they're coming from their own context where they are right at the beginning. They've never launched anything. They've never had even got their first offer. I think this is often where the problem lies is that people, when you brand brand new in this space, you don't really have the full concept.

[00:07:10.680] - Speaker 2

And yes, you are learning and you're working towards it. But like everybody else is just like, whoa, what are all of these people doing and why can't I see that success? Or when I've only got three people who signed up for my webinar and nobody arrived, and then Joseph had a $69,000 beta launch, so I must be doing something wrong.

[00:07:34.080] - Speaker 1

I think that is actually such a great point, which is the person writing the post may not actually be doing anything deceptive. They are being honest. It is a beta launch, but because a newcomer's or you're just not really familiar with the bigger context, the lens you're reading there through is beta must mean first This time. I think that is actually such a good point because I think there are people that have experience. They've been doing the rinse, repeat, rinse, repeat, tweak the offer. It is a a new version, and they beta testing that when they write these kinds of posts. Then I think like Meg saying, there are also people who are saying stuff like, brand new to the online space, and I just did my first launch, and it was like, blah, blah, blah, They're both kinds where you're getting people that are inflating and withholding context, and then people who are posting, assuming everybody understands the context, but actually That you're going to read that through the lens that you're coming to. Again, our one episode, we were like, Stop guru hopping. That there's this frantic energy around, what did you What's the secret?

[00:09:01.450] - Speaker 1

That people read the stuff and then go into this panic mode or this digging mode where they just want to know, tell me, tell me, tell me what you did.

[00:09:11.770] - Speaker 2

That one missing piece.

[00:09:14.420] - Speaker 3

Yeah, the one missing piece. I think that's an excellent second myth, which is that there is only one right way. The only possible right way to succeed is that particular strategy that that guru We often go off down this rabbit hole of it has to be a webinar launch or it has to be a challenge or I've got to go low cost, $9 offers. We're like, But this is the only thing that's going to work now. Then we just burn down everything we've been working on and we start again over here on this new path because somebody did a great job of selling us into their program, and we think that's the only way. But I think the myth that there is one way that is a big one because really all those ways can work if executed correctly. So now someone will come across my Facebook ads, Facebook's Facebook stream and their ad will pop up and it's trying to sell me into their course. And I'm just like, I'm almost like I can feel myself eye rolling. I just want to vomit in the corner every time someone's ad comes across my Facebook feed of their news strategy and it must be done like this.

[00:10:28.720] - Speaker 3

And I'm just like, oh, what I think that only comes with experience, right?

[00:10:34.620] - Speaker 1

Because in the beginning, you're like, Oh, my God, what's the way?

[00:10:38.630] - Speaker 3

Tell me the way.

[00:10:39.400] - Speaker 1

And now you're like, Oh, please. Get off What does that mean?

[00:10:45.600] - Speaker 3

And I think it always comes down to the numbers with any of those strategies. At the end of the day, it's just math. Nowadays, it's all this manifestation stuff and universal is going to fill up my beta launch. And I'm like, okay, but you've got five people on your email list and you're not putting any money into ads. And in order to convert your webinar registrations into sales, you're going to need like 400 people for the goal that you've set yourself. Where are you going to get those 400 people? It blows my mind how many people do not give any sufficient thought into this. It's like, are they going to build their funnel? They build their website. And then it's like, well, but where are you going to get the people?

[00:11:33.840] - Speaker 1

Then if you ask those questions, it's like, why are you being so negative? Just be negative. I'm not being negative. I'm being realistic. It's like, Where are these people? They're like, Don't raid on my manifestation parade. I'm all for manifestation.

[00:11:52.570] - Speaker 3

I think it's great, the whole manifesting. But at the end of the day, it is maps and numbers that are going to fill that funnel and lead through to the conversions. And if you've only got five people on your email list and you're looking for 20 sales in your beta program, you got a bit of a problem. Especially when the first time, let's just say you're going to webinar launch, your conversion from registration through to sale, at best, is probably 3%, but even if you say five %, just to be kind, you You need hundreds of people to get the results that you're looking for. I think people come in with this whole just disillusioned outlook that creating, my dog shaking in the background, but creating and selling an online course can be quick and painless and isn't going to take any work. It takes so much work and it takes a lot of time.

[00:12:54.200] - Speaker 2

I don't know how we've got to this place where people believe that building an online business is just quick and easy. You don't ever go into a face-to-face business and be like, okay, I'll open my doors today and I'll be selling 100,000 tomorrow. That's what people are doing. And somehow you think that because it's online, somehow it's easier, but it's not.

[00:13:24.210] - Speaker 1

We spoke about this. I can't remember which one of our episodes, but I think I was saying that one of One of the things that I started thinking about is there's a blurring between how fast things happen digitally. As a user of digital media, if I'm going online to shop on Amazon, it's so quick. It's like, click, pay, and boom, next day delivery. So digitally, everything happens at the speed of light. I don't know about you guys, but if I have to wait more than a few seconds for a page to load, you would think it's been yours. I am like, What is going on here? It's been 10 seconds. Just relax. But there is this impatience with because everything happens so quickly. We don't have WiFi, we're freaking out. I think there seems to be this idea that because things happen quickly, digitally, we have somehow confused that, well, then when you launch a digital business, it's going to be as quick. And when I started, and I really, hands up, will admit that that is what I thought. I was like, this is the best thing ever. I'm going to be making money while I sleep.

[00:14:41.510] - Speaker 1

I need these people. I'm going to have hundreds of... I'm going to have the post-it where I always speak about the post-it where if you actually walked up to those little post-it, it could say like bread, milk, eggs. Look at all these people that have just joined my online course. I thought that. I was like, this is going to be my reality. Then that first slap in the face is like, it's not quite working out that way. It's like, No, because it's a business, and businesses take time to grow and all the things. Plus, what Meg just hinted at is there are some really good marketers out there. You are buying into, and of course, because they've worked on their messaging and their positioning, and it's all about showing you the inspiration and the aspiration and talking about your pain points. And it's like, psychologically, you are bought in. You are bought in. And then you get in and you're like, Hold Hold on. Oh, now he says, he's been doing this for 10 years. I was like, okay. So I think we just have to have our eyes and our ears wide open. Meg, what else?

[00:15:57.880] - Speaker 1

Give us more of the goal.

[00:16:00.010] - Speaker 3

It does sound negative, though, doesn't it? Gail and I are about to run a training series, and we're like... We called it the straight talk course launch because we just wanted to give everyone a little bit of tough love. And Gail said to me, Do you think anyone's going to want to sign up to hear the real story. Actually, definitely conversions into this training are not as high as other trainings that we have done because people often don't want the truth. But it's like, No, no.

[00:16:28.650] - Speaker 1

There's definitely a shortcut out there and I'm going to find it.

[00:16:31.160] - Speaker 3

It's like, Okay, keep going then.

[00:16:33.050] - Speaker 1

It's the dilemma. And like I was speaking, you two ladies know our friend Deirdre in Canada. And Deirdre often have this discussion, which is like, It takes a toll on you as an entrepreneur when you're really trying to grow your business ethically. You don't want to market bullshit to people. You don't want to sell them something that you just know it's just not how it works. But the dilemma is then people don't want to work with you. People don't want to sign up because they want the glitz, the glamor, that casino like, Oh, my God, I'm going to be making money in us when I sleep and it's going to happen tomorrow. They actually want that. Then they get frustrated when they get in and realize it isn't like that. Then they say, why did no one tell me? And we're like, we try to tell you.

[00:17:30.120] - Speaker 3

I don't want people listening to this to be like, I'm not going to bother. There is so much opportunity out there, but it is a long game. It's a commitment to I'm going to grow this thing over the next few years. The potential for the online space is still limitless. The potential that in a few years you are just drinking your cocktails by the pool, that absolutely can happen, but it's just not as quick as a lot of people would make it out to be.

[00:18:01.940] - Speaker 1

A hundred %. I think when Gail and I were talking about this podcast, she was like, Caz, we just have to remember to keep it hopeful?

[00:18:13.730] - Speaker 2

No, absolutely.

[00:18:15.130] - Speaker 1

I've been losing people so much. I was like, Okay, no, you've got a good point. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:18:22.410] - Speaker 2

Because all we have to do is look at Meg, and Meg is successful, but Meg Maybe Meg, you want to tell us a little bit about your timeline with your online, from when you came in and how long it took to start making money and success and how you've done it, how you've built.

[00:18:46.250] - Speaker 1

All the trials and tribulations, Meg. Just tell us about the bumps and the learning.

[00:18:53.530] - Speaker 3

I first got into it because a guru sold me. I was like, Yeah, the online space, that's totally where is that? I don't know what I'm going to put in an online course, but I'm sure it can come up with something because everyone else is. And so I spent a couple of thousand dollars to get into this program and pretty quickly realized I don't actually have anything to put in an online course, but now I'm in this program. I love the energy. I love the industry. The whole environment was awesome. But I was like, I got nothing to put in an online course right So how the heck am I going to make some money? And so initially I actually reached out to my entrepreneurial friends and said, you're really good at SEO. Could you make a course on that? And you're really good at marketing. Could you make a course on that? And you're very good at selling on Etsy. And I just got six people who were good at something, not connected things, all different. The first thing I ever launched was called Biz Mom School. I'm like, what terrible name was that?

[00:19:56.130] - Speaker 3

Biz Mom School. And I just spent the the first couple of months putting together all their stuff. I had a Kajabi account, software platform for anyone who doesn't know what Kajabi is. And I just hosted everyone's course on my platform. I did all the email sequences, all the sales pages, all the ads. I just learnt it all, trying to get all six courses up and running and sold at the same time. Then we had this two-week period of Biz Mom school. It actually went really well, but I never did it again because I was like, wow, that was a shit ton of work. I'm like, never doing that again. Money-wise, I just split it 50/50 with the creator. There wasn't a whole lot of money that came out of it in the end, but enough validation that I was like, I wanted to do something here. I sold it. People bought it. Now I'm just going to go and find something that's a bit more sustainable. And then I just realized, it's going to take me ages to come up with my own course. But through that process, I've learnt how to use Kajab Kajabi.

[00:21:00.730] - Speaker 3

I just started offering Kajabi as a service to people who did have an idea for a course. Thankfully, a lot of people out there just are happy to pay for done for you services. I started there and then my clients typically all had the same questions about how to use Kajabi. I was like, I'm just going to build a course on how to use Kajabi. The whole Kajabi thing took on a life of its own. It became the done for you services and then the one-on-one coaching and then the group coaching and then the online course and then the Kajabi templates and just a whole lot of things that have evolved over the last five years. Certain bits of my business have been, they're in the beginning, Done For You services was pretty much my whole revenue stream, but it's quite easy to burn out with that, especially if you take on the wrong clients and you're doing all the work yourself. Then I scaled the Done For You back and I scaled the group coaching up. But at the time I was living in Europe and time zones were good. This year, I do not have a great time zone.

[00:22:09.210] - Speaker 3

So again, done for you services have scaled back up and group coaching has scaled back down. So it's You can dial things up and down as needed. But I have found that it's been great having this diverse stream, or revenue streams. And I was reading in the Kajabi creator report this week, they were talking about six-figure creators, people generating more than six figures annually, typically had five or more revenue streams. And so I think another good myth is, you should just have one thing and just rinse and repeat and just sell that over and over again and nothing else. And I've often beaten myself up for like, oh, why do I always feel the need to create something new? Why can't I just focus on that one thing? But I think like, looking back, actually, it's actually worked out pretty well having such a a range of things in the portfolio that are generating money because some of the things do require my time, like done for you services. Then there are the passive income things, like the templates, where you can be making money while you're drinking your cocktails by the pool. I love those days.

[00:23:15.480] - Speaker 3

You're like, Oh, open your email.

[00:23:16.990] - Speaker 2

We were actually sitting by the pool on Rotnest Island, and Meg's like, Oh, I love to see that. There's another one. There's another one. Actually, Meg, your story is very inspiring because first of all, like that very first course with all your friends, it just shows that you actually can think out of the box. It doesn't necessarily need to be something that you yourself can do. Then as you find stuff, then you can create from there. You are a real inspiration just on how to think outside of the box, how to be an entrepreneur.

[00:23:56.480] - Speaker 3

I've always loved collaborating, and I think that is for someone There's somebody out there who's like, Oh, I'm good at the tech stuff or the behind-the-scene stuff, and maybe they don't have the course idea. Just partnering up with someone they know who has the knowledge, but maybe not the tech skills. That collaboration is great because it's difficult to wear all the hats. I'm going to do all the tech and the ads and all the marketing and also create my content at the same time.

[00:24:23.700] - Speaker 1

Yeah, 100%. I think it also shows that where you start off is It wasn't always where you end. You start with an idea and maybe it works for a while and then you learn some lessons and you revisit whether or not it's something you want to do and whether it worked. Was it actually financially? Yeah, it might have worked, but for the amount It's a work I put in, it just wasn't financially worth it. I need to rethink that and then you go in a different direction. Again, it's such a fluid thing. Our lives are based on circumstance and what's It's happening in our personal lives. Sometimes some services that are in demand, you'll find you just doing more of that. Then if that isn't working and you need to pull back, then what can I plug that with? Okay, let me go more with group coaching. It's good to be able to be flexible and adaptable. I think actually all entrepreneurs, certainly the ones I know, have that characteristic in common. It's like they are not scared of being adaptable and quickly pivoting and reading a room as it would be, and then just adjusting.

[00:25:37.280] - Speaker 1

They're really quick on their feet like that, which is amazing. I think, again, that Gail's right. It's really inspiring I spent some time with you in person, and I just know you're just always so honest and upfront about what is happening for you. It's not like trying to put on a show. I think in the beginning, and I was telling Gail about this incredible speaker that I heard very recently talking at a function. Now where she is in this high-powered position, but she was sharing her backstory. One thing she said really stuck out for me, and she said, Never be ashamed of small beginnings. I think that there is something... A lot of people are embarrassed to say, I only had three people come, or I only had... And there's this pressure. I certainly felt pressure to have these sparkly, big numbers members. It would be embarrassing to say only if they would say, I only... It goes to kids, how the registration is going for you? Whatever. And I'd be like, oh, my God, I don't want to tell her they've only been eight. And then of those eight, only two people actually came.

[00:26:58.670] - Speaker 1

But it's not necessary. It's like we all have to start somewhere. There's that. Meg's always just honest about, at this point this was working, now it's not working anymore. Now I need to do this. But I What do you think? Again, there's this glamorization of going all in. Go all in, back yourself. Really believe in yourself and go all in on this one thing. But there are practicalities in life and If you are transitioning in a career or an offer, it's wonderful to back yourself and it's wonderful to have this one thing, but sometimes that is not going to bring enough money to support your life and your responsibility. So the idea of thinking like, Okay, so how can I pair that with multiple ways to earn money is a good idea.

[00:27:55.650] - Speaker 3

I think the reading the room is a big one, and I've just felt it, even looking at my clients and how their launches are going, but looking at my own launches, that I just have this feeling in the last 12 months that people are feeling like Zoom fatigued. They don't want to join another group coaching program for whatever. It's like, please don't make me be on Zoom at 8:00 AM on Wednesdays for the next eight weeks. I could easily deliver a group coaching program on how to use Kajabi. I could do it every week for the next eight weeks. But I I just feel it won't sell the way that it was selling originally. People just seem to have moved. Just the whole... There's just been that shift of, well, yeah, but I'm really busy with this other stuff and I just want to outsource it. So I'd rather take that money that I was going to put into your course and just pay someone else to do it for me. And it's like, fair enough. I totally get where you're coming from. But as a business owner, that means, all right, well, if we're not going to pick up that revenue there, then we need to offer more done for you services.

[00:28:57.040] - Speaker 3

So we have to ramp that up.

[00:28:58.600] - Speaker 1

Yeah, 100 %. Well, Meg, thank you so much for your time. And where can our listeners find you? We will, of course, drop all the links, all the good stuff to how people can get hold of you. But where is the best place for people to connect with you?

[00:29:18.250] - Speaker 3

The easiest place is just my website. So just meggburge. Com and all roads lead from there. So you'll find me on Instagram, trying to grow my Instagram following Well, and I met somebody this week with 682,000 followers, and I was like, I only have 1,600. Back into that trap of comparison. I'm like, Oh, certain areas of your business can be doing great and other areas can just speak.

[00:29:47.640] - Speaker 3

Okay, cool. The website it is then and go give me a follow.

[00:29:52.410] - Speaker 1

She wants more followers. Go follow me.

[00:29:55.600] - Speaker 2

Yeah, we tried so hard.

[00:29:58.360] - Speaker 3

But yeah, lovely talking to you guys.

[00:29:59.980] - Speaker 2

Yeah, thanks, man.

[00:30:01.360] - Speaker 3

Very refreshing.

[00:30:03.910] - Speaker 1

Awesome. I hope you two have the best time together. Just enjoy each other's company, and we will catch up again soon.

[00:30:13.230] - Speaker 1

Okay.

[00:30:13.590] - Speaker 3

Thanks. Bye.